The Deity of Christ from the Old Testament for our Jehovah’s Witness, Mormon, and Muslim friends, part 2.

Today we are going to pick up where we left off from the last article you can read it here.  Earlier we examined Genesis 15:1-2 to see that the Word of the Lord is God.  We also connected these verses with John 1:1-18 to see that the Word is Jesus.  Today we are going to look at Genesis 15:3-7 which will reinforce our previous assertion that the Word of the Lord is God, Jesus is the Word, and Jesus is God.  [The text in the brackets is mine.]  The blue text indicates who is doing the action and the red is what is being done.

Genesis 15:3-7 (NASB) 3 And Abram said, “Since You have given no offspring to me, one born in my house is my heir.” 4 Then behold, the word of the Lord came to him, saying,

[If you notice, the person doing the talking is identified as “the word of the Lord.”  You can tell he is a person because he is, “saying.”  The word of the Lord is speaking to Abram.]

“This man will not be your heir; but one who will come forth from your own body, he shall be your heir.” 5 And He took him outside and said,

[Notice the Word is referred to as, “He.”  What did He do?  He, “took him outside and said…”  How can anyone look at these verses and not come to the conclusion that the Word of the Lord is God, and how can they, in light of John 1:1-18 not see that Jesus is the Word and He is God?]

“Now look toward the heavens, and count the stars, if you are able to count them.” And He said to him, “So shall your descendants be.” 6  Then he believed in the Lord; and He reckoned it to him as righteousness. 7 And He said to him, “I am the Lord who brought you out of Ur of the Chaldeans, to give you this land to possess it.

If this isn’t enough, I’ll post some more later on.  Study the word, to know the Word, and His intent.  Knowing Him is knowing God.  To know God, and be known by Him, to be His adopted child and heir, is to be saved by this Triune God’s grace according to His sovereign will, regenerating and indwelling by His Spirit, and the justifying work on the cross of His Son.

The Deity of Christ from the Old Testament for our Jehovah’s Witness, Mormon, and Muslim friends.

lamb

I don’t know how many times I’ve heard the same accusation from Jehovah’s Witnesses, Mormons (LDS), and Muslims.  They claim that Jesus is not God, but a god, good man, prophet, teacher, and so on.  I think it is great that we can always go to the word of God to let it make the defense.  Charles Spurgeon was quoted as saying, “The Word of God is like a lion. You don’t have to defend a lion. All you have to do is let the lion loose, and the lion will defend itself.”  I agree with him.

With that being said let’s take a look at Genesis 15:1-2, and John 1:1-18.

In Genesis 15:1-2 we see that the word of the LORD came to Abram in a vision. Now, you don’t hear a vision. You see it. Some people would insist that this is just Abram hearing God speak to him, but this is actually the preincarnate Christ appearing to Abram in a vision, and speaking to him. Abram said, “…O LORD God…” or אֲדֹנָי ’ăḏônây; an emphatic form of âḏôn; or (shortened) אָדֹן ’adon; from an unused root (meaning to rule); sovereign, i.e. controller (human or divine): — lord, master, owner. Compare also names beginning with “Adoni-”.; the Lord (used as a proper name of God only): — (my) Lord. In this section of God’s word ăḏônây is used in conjunction with יְהוָֹה yhwh; (the) self-Existent or Eternal; name of God: — the Lord. So essentially he is saying, Adonai YHWH or Sovereign eternal self-existent one and only true God.  It is obvious that Abram believed the word of the LORD to be the one true, eternal, and self-existent God.

We can look at John 1:1-18 and see who John said the Word of God is. Again, it is obvious that Jesus is the Word.

John 1:1-18 (NASB) 1  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2  He was in the beginning with God. 3  All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being. 4  In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. 5  The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.
The Witness John
6 There came a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7  He came  as a witness, to testify about the Light, so that all might believe through him. 8   He was not the Light, but he came to testify about the Light.
9 There was the true Light which, coming into the world, enlightens every man. 10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. 11 He came to His own, and those who were His own did not receive Him. 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, 13  who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.
The Word Made Flesh
14 And the Word became flesh, and  dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth. 15 John *testified about Him and cried out, saying, “This was He of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.’” 16 For of His fullness we have all received, and grace upon grace. 17 For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ. 18  No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.

Jesus is not a god like the Mormons say.  He was not Michael the angel transfigured like the Jehovah’s Witnesses would tell you.  He was not just a prophet like Muslims claim.  If there is any doubt now that Jesus is the Word, and the Word is God, it is not due to lack of evidence.  It is due to disbelief.  May God grant you true and saving faith in the Savior, Jesus Christ our Lord and God.

 

The L.D.S. Articles of faith shown in error contrasted with the truth of the Bible.

Today we are going to look at the Latter Day Saint’s Articles of Faith, written by their prophet Joseph Smith, to see how it conflicts with Orthodox Christianity.  It is important to note how they use the same words we do, but define them very differently.

The Articles of Faithof The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

Chapter 1

1 We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.

2 We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam’s transgression.

3 We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.

4 We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.

5 We believe that a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.

6 We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.

7 We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues, and so forth.

8 We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.

9 We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.

10 We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.

11 We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.

12 We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.

13 We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.

Joseph Smith.

The first one seems alright until you ask them to define their terms, then we see the vast chasm that separates them from the true faith.

1 We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.

Their father was once a man named Elohim (which is amusing because Elohim is the Hebrew word for god)  This man followed the doctrines of the LDS faith so well that he became an exalted man, then the god who rules this solar system.  According to the LDS faith, he has a flesh and bone body and is a caucasian.  When they say he is eternal they only mean that he was part of the eternal energy and intellect.  They only believe that matter and intellect are eternal.  They believe that Elohim was the son of his parents as they were children of their parents and so on approaching infinity.  In that sense, they call him eternal.  They believe that Jesus is actually his son through sexual copulation and that the holy spirit is simple the spirit of the father.

2 We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam’s transgression.

They deny man’s inherited sin nature in Adam, conflicting with what the Bible says in 1 Corinthians 15 as Adam being our federal head.  Denial of total depravity also helps them justify other abhorrent beliefs.

3 We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.

They deny limited atonement and affirm that man’s salvation is by his obedience to the laws and ordinances of the gospel.  It must be noted that they do not mean the moral law of the Bible, and they do not mean the gospel of Christ when they refer to, “ordinances of the gospel.”  They are talking about their own set of laws and ordinances that their prophets have made up and recorded for them to follow.  Thus their salvation is one of works not grace for grace is unmerited favor and by definition can not be of our own being.  This belief is also in direct conflict with the Bible for we know, “For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.” Ephesians 2:8-9

4 We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Again this sounds good until you find out what they believe about Jesus, the gospel, faith, repentance, baptism and the laying on of hands.  I’ve already explained that their jesus is a created being who is not God.  Their gospel is a list of works and doctrines that must be obeyed so it is no good news at all.  Read their book, “Doctrines and Covenants” if you want to understand what they call the gospel.  The Christian gospel, εὐαγγέλιον-euangelion, or good message is one of salvation by grace, not adherence to a moral code written by a false prophet.  Their repentance is not the repentance that leads to life, because theirs is the one that leaves them dead.  They have a works righteous repentance where they admit wrongdoing and attempt in their own dead flesh to not do it again.  As we know the repentance that leads to life is actually the repentance of their type of repentance.  For someone to truly be LDS they must be baptised into the cult.  It is a necessity.  In Christianity baptismal regeneration is a heresy.  They believe in apostolic succession.  This is also a false teaching.  We know there are no more Apostles in the same sense as the ones who were with the incarnate Christ and sent by Him to build the Church upon Him as the rock.  We also know that the Holy Spirit indwells all regenerate believers.  

5 We believe that a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.

This also sounds good until you understand what they mean.  Their god can call nobody, because he doesn’t exist.  Their god is a fictional character imagined by Joseph Smith.  The only people who can be leaders in their cult are those who have been approved by the men who have already been firmly entrenched into their cult.

6 We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.

Smith uses the phrase, “so forth” without being specific about other offices they affirm.  It is almost as if he was just too lazy and didn’t want to look into it.  Again he is using words that are in the Bible and redefining them.  One who is sent with a message is an apostle according to the Bible in a sense all Christians are apostles.  We are not Apostles in the sense of, “The Apostles.”  A person who declares the reality of what God says as actual truth is a Prophet.  Prophets who declared portions of God’s word that had not occurred yet are not predicting the future like a fortune teller.  If God says something is going to happen it has already happened we just haven’t gotten that far down the timeline yet.  Modern Prophets are just reading the Bible out loud.  We have the complete word of God given to us in the Bible, there is no more to come.  Jesus perfectly fulfilled the role of Prophet, as He is the Word made flesh.

7 We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues, and so forth.

Of course they affirm all sorts of extra-biblical revelation.  It is the only way they can justify believing the lies of Joseph Smith and all of the other false prophets of their faith.

8 We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.

Here is the kicker.  It seems fine, and you might even agree that the Bible does need to be translated correctly, but that is not how they use this.  Whenever you bring up a conflict between what the false doctrines of the LDS are and show them the Bible they default to this article.  “Oh the Bible has been corrupted here and it wasn’t properly translated.”  They, like so many cults and satan in Genesis call people to doubt the word of God.  Satan tempted Eve by telling her God’s word is not true and that she could become like God.  It is interesting that the LDS say the same thing satan said.  Genesis 3:1-7 Now the serpent was more crafty than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said to the woman, “Indeed, has God said, ‘You shall not eat from any tree of the garden’?” The woman said to the serpent, “From the fruit of the trees of the garden we may eat; but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, ‘You shall not eat from it or touch it, or you will die.’” The serpent said to the woman, “You surely will not die! “For God knows that in the day you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was desirable to make one wise, she took from its fruit and ate; and she gave also to her husband with her, and he ate. Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves loin coverings.”

9 We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.

The LDS are continuationists in the extreme sense.  They don’t just believe in continued miracle healings like our charismatic brother, but exceed that of acceptable doctrine by preaching extra-biblical revelations and more revealed truths that supercede and abrogate the word of God that we have.

10 We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.

That’s right, you read it correctly, Joseph Smith wrote there were only 10 tribes.  What happened to the other 2?  They believe that there were 10 lost Hebrew tribes that fled to America in antiquity.  They also believe that ‘Merica! is going to be where the New Jerusalem will be…  Come on? Really?  I know, I know, it baffles the mind, but this is what they believe.  When you are a false prophet you can say just about anything even stuff that is flat out fiction.

11 We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.

This is a pretty relativistic statement in practice.  It sounds innocuous enough to be non-threatening, but if they truly believe this why do they send out missionaries?

12 We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.

Interesting that there is no clause to disobey the government when it is compelling the people to disobey God.  The Bible is pretty clear that we stop obeying the government when it tells us to disobey God.  Like their 11th article it is a product of the time.  During this period in American history mormons were seen as a dangerous cult.  They were forced out of cities and towns as they followed their outlaw leaders who were  horse thieves, and crooks.  They were not well liked or respected due to their insane beliefs and practices.

13 We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.

Joseph Smith attempts to tie it all up here and put a pretty spin on things, but let’s see what they really pursued, polygamy, false prophecies that never came true, false prophets whose prophecies they built their faith on, immoral ceremonial practices, oh oh and, “So forth” (I’m kidding, I won’t do to you what Joseph Smith did to you) works righteousness in a graceless man-centered system, they have believed the lie instead of the truth, a false jesus who is a creation and can not save from sin, and a god who is not eternal.

If the LDS are right about who God is, then God and His word are wrong.

If the LDS are right about who God is, then God and His word are wrong.

In the Bible we have doctrines that are expressed by Jesus Himself, The one and only God incarnate, none ever before Him and none after Him anywhere or anytime.  These doctrines are repeated and expounded upon by the Apostles in the Epistles of the New Covenant recorded in the New Testament.  These doctrines are exclusive claims to actual truths.  When someone else confesses a doctrine that asserts something other than what has already been established by the one true, immutable, and infallible God, then our only option is to reject their  assertion as heresy.

Let’s look at some of their doctrines that conflict with Biblical doctrines, and are mutually exclusive in their claims.  Christians claim there is only one true God.  There has never been any other god besides Him. He has always existed in trinity. He has never not existed.  We also claim that if you don’t believe in Him as explained here, as one being in three personages, that you can not be called part of the Church.  Because, you have put your faith in a different god.  Obviously, worshipping a different god makes you not a Christian.

Latter Day Saints (LDS or Mormons) do not have one triune God.  They actually have a number of gods approaching infinity.  They choose to worship just one of the gods Joseph Smith imagined for them.  The god they choose to worship, was once a man named Elohim.  He lived on a planet orbiting a star called Kolab.  So their god is an E.T. extra terrestrial, alien from outer space.  Allegedly he was such a good follower of the mormon doctrines that he was promoted to being an exalted man.  He eventually became the god of this solar system and the Earth that we live on.  So the one god that they worship out of the billions of gods they have, was once a created man.  He was born of his father god and goddess mother.  They now call him Heavenly Father and believe he has a body of flesh and bone.  They believe that he had sex with Mary the virgin and that Jesus the spirit child was then embodied in his biological son with Mary.  Here is a quote from the Brigham Young University site,

As the Prophet Joseph Smith said, “God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret” (TPJS, p. 345). Thus, the Father became the Father at some time before “the beginning” as humans know it, by experiencing a mortality similar to that experienced on earth. There has been speculation among some Latter-day Saints on the implications of this doctrine, but nothing has been revealed to the Church about conditions before the “beginning” as mortals know it. The important points of the doctrine for Latter-day Saints are that Gods and humans are the same species of being, but at different stages of development in a divine continuum, and that the heavenly Father and Mother are the heavenly pattern, model, and example of what mortals can become through obedience to the gospel (see Mother in Heaven). Knowing that they are the literal offspring of Heavenly Parents and that they can become like those parents through the gospel of Jesus Christ is a wellspring of religious motivation. With God as the literal Father and with humans having the capacity to become like him, the basic religious questions “Where did I come from?,” “Why am I here?,” and What is my destiny?” are fundamentally answered.

Keep in mind that our LDS friends co-opt many of our words.  They mean something completely different to them.  When we talk of God the Father or Jesus we are talking about a very different God than they are.  They might believe we are talking about the same god, but they have better and more true information than we do.  The gospel to them is not the same things we think of.  Their gospel is a bunch of laws, rules, do’s and don’ts, from their book Doctrine and Covenants.  Our understanding comes from the Biblical definition.  The word, “gospel” means, “good message or news.”  When we think of the gospel of Jesus, we understand it to mean the penal substitutionary atonement wrought by Christ God Himself for the salvation of His sovereignly elected saints to bring glory to His name. In Christianity the work has been done by Jesus.  He paid for our sins.  By repenting and believing in Him, his work is imputed to us.  It is done, done, done.  We do good works because of our new affections and desires born from a regenerated spirit as born again believers.

with this article on only of few of the many differences, I hope it is obvious that the LDS are not Christian.  They are a polytheistic Arian cult, created by the false prophet Joseph Smith.

Mormons believe that salvation comes through Joseph Smith!!! No, I’m not kidding, it is on this website.

Mormons believe that salvation comes through Joseph Smith!!! No, I’m not kidding, it is on this website.http://www.mormonhandbook.com/home/salvation.html#joseph

To understand the LDS view of salvation it is helpful to first understand these LDS views: God …
MORMONHANDBOOK.COM

What is the difference between the Mormon gospel and the gospel of the true Jesus?

glennbeck

According to the documentation on the Mormons own website; “https://www.lds.org/scriptures/bd/gospels”

“…The word gospel means “good news.” The good news is that Jesus Christ has made a perfect atonement for mankind that will redeem all mankind from the grave and reward each individual according to his or her works. This atonement was begun by His appointment in the premortal world but was worked out by Jesus during His mortal sojourn. Therefore, the records of His mortal life and the events pertaining to His ministry are called the Gospels; the four that are contained in our Bible are presented under the names of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John…”

They only had one thing right, and that was the meaning of the word, “gospel.”  Too bad they got everything else wrong.  The Greek word, “εὐαγγέλιον” transliterated is evangelion.  It is where we get our English word, “evangelist” in English we use the word, “gospel” which was an English rendering of a Latin expression meaning, “God’s spell” or “God’s story.”  εὐαγγέλιον means, “good news.”  So what is the good news of Jesus Christ?  Well according to the Mormons it is that everyone lives on after death while some go to one of the three forms of Mormon afterlife determined by their own works.  So basically you go where your works have earned you.  So if you were an uber goody-two-shoes Mormon and followed all the rules you might become an exalted man and one day even a god.  You would get to go to the celestial kingdom until you became a god and had your own solar-system to rule.  If you only were a marginal Mormon you get to go to the terrestial kingdom with all the slackers who were basically good.  Of course if you weren’t a Mormon at all you would have to go to the telestial kingdom and work your way up.

I’m sorry but none of that sounds like very good news to me.  I don’t think that anyone who has ever read the Bible and knows what sin is and what righteousness is would think that is good news.  It looks like insanely BAD news to me.  They are saying that you have to earn your way by works.  Not a lifetime of good works could void even one of my sins.  If you are a thief and you go before the judge and tell him, “Your honor, listen I know I shouldn’t have stolen that ladies purse.  I know it is against the law, but since then I have worked hard and given to charity, and I even washed your car on the way in.”  The judge if he is a just and good judge will say, “None of those things change the fact that you are guilty of the crime of theft.  The fact that you would come in here a guilty thief and try to bribe me with your charity work and washing my car is offensive to me.  You are guilty and here is your sentence.”

If a human judge would be offended how much more would a perfectly and infinitely holy and righteous God be offended?  There is no way to work your way in to Heaven according to the Bible.  Anyone that has honestly read it would tell you that, but the Bible isn’t good enough for the Mormons… oh no!  They have to add the Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, and the Doctrine and Covenants.  You see if you are going to try to deceive the world you really have to convolute the truth and by muddying the waters they can do that.

So what is the difference between real Christianity and Mormonism’s gospel?  What is the difference between their Jesus and ours?  Well it is quite simple you see Jesus is God.  Not a god, but the God.  Jesus paid the penalty for the sins of all who He would save.  They couldn’t pay their penalty.  Just one deceitful or lustful thought is enough to warrant an eternity in Hell experiencing the wrath of God being poured out on you for ever.  God would be just and right to do so as He is the perfection of goodness, justice, and righteousness.  A person who doesn’t see how insidious and sinful their sin is in contrast to the holiness of God will never understand their inability.  Of course they think they can earn it because they have brought God down to being at one time a man who lived on a planet orbiting a star named Kolob and who was a sinner and they have elevated man to a being that could earn of his own works godhood!  What complete and utter nonsense and heresy!  Jesus saves us by His grace (unmerited favor) He paid our penalty and imputed His righteousness to those He would save.  They are seen as perfectly righteous and holy upon judgment because they are in Christ Jesus through God granted faith.

So our deceived Mormon friends and family are destined for Hell.  What can we do about it?  How can we help them?  Over many years I have tried several different methods of reaching them.  It seems impossible at times, but we know in regards to salvation anything is possible with God.  I would recommend praying for them.  I would also recommend being their friends while gently sharing the differences you have.  I would also recommend that you get offended when they say they are Christians.  Let them see the joy you have in Christ.  Let them see your liberty to love and your light heart.  Let them see that you are at peace with God and assured of your salvation.  They are burdened with upholding so many rules and rituals that they are always about to crack.  They never can know if they have done enough.  Always tell them the truth about Jesus.  Don’t get into a shouting match with them.  Don’t go into a discussion without first arming yourself with knowledge of the word.  If they throw the, “You’re anti-Mormon” card just tell them you are not and ask them about the, “First Vision.”  It is the one where Joseph Smith supposedly sees God the Father and Jesus both in bodily form and they tell him that all of the churches are false and their teachings are abominations and to join none of them.

jm_400_CH1.pd-P4.tiff

Then explain how offensive that is to you.  Explain that they are just as much anti-Christian as they claim we are anti-mormon.

The next time a Mormon tells you that you are anti-mormon

Joseph_Smith_Hat_South_park

The next time a Mormon tells you that you are anti-mormon you tell them that you are not and that they are anti-Christian.  Then point them to the account of, “The First Vision” and Doctrine and Covenants 130.  Then they will see just how anti-everyone else they are.  Here is what the First Vision says about us;

17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!

18 My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join.

19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.”

20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time.

https://www.lds.org/scriptures/pgp/js-h/1?lang=eng

So according to the, “First Vision” we are all wrong and our beliefs are abominable.  Oh and Joseph Smith says there that the Father and Jesus appeared both bodily.  This is also backed up by D&C 130 which I will now quote;

“ 21 And when we obtain any blessing from God, it is by obedience to that law upon which it is predicated.

22 The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s; the Son also; but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones, but is a personage of Spirit. Were it not so, the Holy Ghost could not dwell in us.” https://www.lds.org/scriptures/dc-testament/dc/130?lang=eng

So you can see here how they claim that the Father also has a body of flesh and blood even though the Bible teaches that the Father is Spirit.  We worship a different God then they do.  Don’t let Mormons get away with calling you anti-mormon when you disagree with them.  If they do, show them how they were anti-Christian first.  We have 2000 years of orthodoxy, tons of artifacts, over 4500 pieces of textual evidence supporting the continuity of the Bible, and geographic sites all over the middle east that support what the Bible says.  They have the wild imaginings of a fallen sinner hungry for power, wealth, and sexual immorality.

 

The evils of unorthodox ecumenism.

ec·u·me·nism  (ky-m-nzm, -ky-)

1. A movement promoting unity among Christian churches or denominations.

2. A movement promoting worldwide unity among religions through greater cooperation and improved understanding.

 

There is a proper ecumenism within the orthodox denominations and then there is the ecumenical movement which is not good.  It is one of unifying the body of Christ with false churches.  For instance Baptists, Presbyterians, and Methodists might get together to have a worship service including singing, praying, and communion.  They could do this because they worship the same God and agree who God is by affirming all of the same Primary Articles of Faith.  What it can’t be is orthodox denominations doing this with false churches that are apostate, or heretical and outside of orthodoxy.  For instance if we had Methodists, Baptists, Roman Catholics, and Mormons getting together to have a worship service including singing, praying, and communion.  This can not be due to the fact that the Roman Catholic Church and the LDS worship a different God than that of the Bible.  The RCC worships a god that does not save you by grace alone.  You must belong to the RCC, practice it’s sacraments, be baptized into it, and further they believe that Mary did not die but was ascended to heaven and is your co-redemtrix who brings your prayers to the feat of Christ and without her your prayers can not be heard and you can not be saved.  They also believe in an infusement of righteousness that you must maintain.  You get an initial washing and then must keep yourself saved.  This is not the same gospel nor the same God of the Bible.  The LDS believe in a god that is not the one and only god and that is not eternal.  Their god can not save you either.

 

Ecumenism is an important.  We must know what a true Church is and how we should interact with them and how we should interact with false churches.

 

Here is a good sermon from A.W. Tozer.  Even though he preached this years and years ago it is still relevant and informative.

http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=298

 

 

 

www.GotQuestions.org
Question: “Is ecumenism biblical? Should a Christian be involved in the ecumenical movement?” Answer: Walter A. Elwell, in The Concise Evangelical Dictionary of Theology, defines ecumenism as “The organized attempt to bring about the cooperation and unity among Christians.” On an international level, the World Council of Churches represents ecumenism when it states its purpose this way (as taken from its website: http://www.wcc-coe.org): “The World Council of Churches is a fellowship of churches which confess the Lord Jesus Christ as God and Savior according to the scriptures, and therefore seek to fulfill together their common calling to the glory of the one God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit. It is a community of churches on the way to visible unity in one faith and one eucharistic fellowship, expressed in worship and in common life in Christ. It seeks to advance towards this unity, as Jesus prayed for his followers, ‘so that the world may believe’ (John 17:21).” On a national level, a document called Evangelicals and Catholics Together: The Christian Mission in the Third Millennium, published in 1994 and endorsed by some rather prominent representatives of Evangelical Christianity and Roman Catholicism, is another example of ecumenism. The important question is this: Are ecumenical ventures right and biblical? Should we be involved with other “Christians” in joint ventures, either locally, nationally or internationally? The answer to this question is not black and white. As is almost always the case, one must weigh out the answer in each situation specifically. However, there are a couple of biblical guidelines which will help us make God-honoring decisions regarding ecumenism. First of all, Are those we are joining with truly Christians in the biblical sense of the word? Many people and organizations in America and the world “name the Name of Jesus Christ” and even state He is Lord and Savior and yet clearly reject what the Bible says about Him. Obvious examples of this are Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses. They will say they are followers of Jesus Christ and are Christian and yet deny with vehemence what the Bible declares concerning Christ’s nature and work. A not-so-obvious example comes in the form of liberal Christianity. Liberal Christianity is found in almost every denomination in the United States and, although it may seem very Christian, usually liberal Christians reject several essential biblical truths such as the inspiration and authority of the Bible (2 Timothy 3:16), Jesus as the only Savior of the entire world (John 14:6, 1 Timothy 2:5), and salvation as God’s free gift to those who believe apart from good works (Romans 3:24, 28; Galatians 2:16; Ephesians 2:8-9). As seen with the publication of Evangelicals and Catholics Together, there is a major emphasis in our day on ecumenical unity among Evangelicals and Roman Catholics. Those who promote such unity state that both are Christian and both are viable, God-honoring systems of faith. But clearly the substantial differences between the two groups render ECT a ridiculous document. Biblical Christianity and Roman Catholicism are two different religions that practice and believe different things about how one is saved, the authority of the Bible, the priesthood of believers, the nature of man, the work of Christ on the cross, etc. The list of irreconcilable differences between what the Bible says and what the Roman Catholic Church says makes any joint mission between the two absolutely impossible. Those who deny this are not being true to what they say they believe, no matter which side they are on. Any Catholic who is serious about his faith will deny what a serious evangelical Christian believes and vice-versa. The difficulty with ecumenism is that often the above listed groups are passionately like-minded with biblical Christians regarding a given issue. Biblical Christians are usually marked by a strong pro-life belief, a strong traditional view of the family, a strong emphasis on compassion for the homeless and sick, and a strong desire to see justice in the world. The above groups are often marked by the same desires. Thus, the temptation to “pool resources” in pursuit of a common cause is sometimes great. This leads to the next guideline. Second, what is the ultimate goal of this ecumenical venture? The Scriptures give clear guidance as to how Bible-believing Christians are to live their lives. Colossians 3:17 states our purpose this way, “Whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through Him to God the Father.” Regarding our interactions with the lost, unbelieving world, Jesus states this in Matthew 5:16, “Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven.” Some familiar verses are Matthew 28:18-20, also known as the Great Commission, “And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, ‘All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.’” In summary, all that we do is to bring glory and honor to God. Regarding the lost of this world, Christians bring glory to God when God uses the believer to further His kingdom through evangelism and discipleship. This is to be the motivation of the Bible-believing Christian’s interaction with the world. Regarding ecumenical ventures, we need to ask ourselves whether or not these goals are being pursued. Often, in our day, the political and/or social desires of the participants are the driving motivators behind an ecumenical venture. A prime example of this is the current drive to pass a constitutional amendment declaring that the only marriage that will be recognized in the United States is the traditional, man/woman union. If our churches ecumenically join together in pursuit of this goal (passing out fliers, hosting a rally, etc), how are we striving for the above stated biblical purposes? Are we not simply striving for political and social achievement? How will the practicing, unbelieving homosexual view our Savior and Lord if all he sees in us is political activism and no compassion and no outreach? The ultimate goal of our actions should be the salvation of lost sinners, which we once were (Ephesians 2:1-3). The Bible tells us that the angels of heaven rejoice over one sinner who repents (Luke 15:10). There is no passage that declares that the angels rejoice when a law is passed. This applies to homosexuality, abortion, drug-abuse, etc. God is glorified when we demonstrate Christlikeness to the lost. As we contemplate ecumenical ventures within our society, we need to make sure the venture is one in which God’s kingdom is expanded through pursuing the lost with the gospel, be they practicing immorality, abortion-rights activists, homeless, drug-abusers, criminals, etc. In conclusion, should we be involved in ecumenical cooperation with other Christians and churches? If the above conditions are met in a God-honoring way, we may freely and joyfully join with other believers in pursuit of God’s kingdom. The ultimate goal is God’s glory and the evangelism and discipleship of the lost. The ecumenical venture must be structured in this way. Thus, those we join with must believe the biblical definition of the gospel and they must also be about seeking the same goal of God’s glory and the salvation of the lost.

© Copyright 2002-2014 Got Questions Ministries.

Read more: http://www.gotquestions.org/Printer/ecumenism-ecumenical-PF.html#ixzz35Tv4Ja3H

Joseph Smith fixes the Bible and Mormons believe this guy?

100301sick_hat_joseph_smith

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hey kids! Me again, did you know that Joseph Smith, the false prophet who founded Mormonism, fixed the Bible for us to?  Don’t be surprised if you hadn’t heard.  It is a little publicized thing.  They like to say that they use the King James Version, but they don’t really believe it is accurate.  “8 We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.”

For not having the internet to look up Hebrew sources, for having to rely on hand copied manuscripts in the original languages and for not having discovered as many ancient manuscripts the old KJV translators did a pretty good job.  I wonder what happened to Joe Smith’s translation?  Well, I think we know.  By this time he had already gone on paper and proclaimed many false prophecies and new doctrines and once you’ve done that without studying the Bible you have to go back and change one or the other.  Can you guess which one he chose to change?  I’ll give you a hint, it rhymes with heretic, oh you caught me it doesn’t rhyme with heretic.  That’s right he changed the Bible!  What audacity!  Hadn’t he heard of the Septuagint?  Hadn’t he heard of the Dead Sea Scrolls?  Nope, the Dead Sea Scrolls weren’t dug up until the middle part of the last century, and apparently he didn’t even bother looking at the Septuagint, which was the Bible for the true Church as early as the 3rd century B.C.  The books we have in the Old Covenant were compiled and translated from Hebrew into Koine Greek, then later as the progressive revelation continued, the other books were added.  So this is the Bible the Church used and the Apostles quoted, but it wasn’t good enough for Joseph Smith!  Nope, he had to support all of his heresy.

So today I thought we would take a look at just a few differences in the Book of Genesis.  We will also look at the consequences.

Genesis 1:1 JST “And it came to pass, that the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Behold, I reveal unto you concerning this heaven and this earth; write the words which I speak.”

Genesis 1:1 NASB “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.”

Hebrew Genesis 1:1 “בְּרֵאשִׁ֖ית בָּרָ֣א אֱלֹהִ֑ים אֵ֥ת הַשָּׁמַ֖יִם וְאֵ֥ת הָאָֽרֶץ׃” or bə-rê-šîṯ (In the beginning) bā-rā (created) ’ĕ-lō-hîm; (God) ’êṯ  haš-šā-ma-yim (the heavens) wə-’êṯ (and) hā-’ā-reṣ. (the earth)

And finally the KJV that J.S. didn’t think supported his false prophecies and doctrines enough so he just changed it to make it fit better.

Genesis 1:1 KJV “In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.”

Can you see a difference yet?  Pretty obvious he didn’t use any manuscripts to translate from.  Matter of fact he didn’t even claim that he did.  Nope, he just studied the Bible and changed it the way he claimed it was revealed to him to change.  You read correctly, he used personal revelation as his means for rewriting the GOD’S WORD.  Remember, the Mormons claim the Bible is not translated correctly and that is why they can just disregard it when it doesn’t support their doctrine.   I would compare the first verse to the other translations, but there is no need to.  It doesn’t match at all.  Let’s see if it gets any better in the next few verses.

JST Genesis 1:2-8

“2 I am the Beginning and the End; the Almighty God. By mine Only Begotten I created these things.

 

3 Yea, in the beginning I created the heaven, and the earth upon which thou standest.

 

4 And the earth was without form, and void; and I caused darkness to come up upon the face of the deep.

 

5 And my Spirit moved upon the face of the waters, for I am God.

 

6 And I, God, said, Let there be light, and there was light.

 

7 And I, God, saw the light, and that light was good. And I, God, divided the light from the darkness.

 

8 And I, God, called the light day, and the darkness I called night. And this I did by the word of my power; and it was done as I spake. And the evening and the morning were the first day.”

And now the NASB

2The earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters. 3Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4God saw that the light was good; and God separated the light from the darkness. 5God called the light day, and the darkness He called night. And there was evening and there was morning, one day.

6Then God said, “Let there be an expanse in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters.” 7God made the expanse, and separated the waters which were below the expanse from the waters which were above the expanse; and it was so. 8God called the expanse heaven. And there was evening and there was morning, a second day.

And the Hebrew,

וְהָאָ֗רֶץ הָיְתָ֥ה תֹ֙הוּ֙ וָבֹ֔הוּ וְחֹ֖שֶׁךְ עַל־פְּנֵ֣י תְהֹ֑ום וְר֣וּחַ אֱלֹהִ֔ים מְרַחֶ֖פֶת עַל־פְּנֵ֥י הַמָּֽיִם׃

Str Translit Hebrew English Morph
776 [e] wə-hā-’ā-reṣ, וְהָאָ֗רֶץ And the earth Noun
1961 [e] hā-yə-ṯāh הָיְתָ֥ה was Verb
8414 [e] ṯō-hū תֹ֙הוּ֙ without form Noun
922 [e] wā-ḇō-hū, וָבֹ֔הוּ and void Noun
2822 [e] wə-ḥō-šeḵ וְחֹ֖שֶׁךְ and darkness Noun
5921 [e] ‘al- עַל־ [was] on Prep
6440 [e] pə-nê פְּנֵ֣י the face Noun
8415 [e] ṯə-hō-wm; תְה֑וֹם of the deep Noun
7307 [e] wə-rū-aḥ וְר֣וּחַ And the Spirit Noun
430 [e] ’ĕ-lō-hîm, אֱלֹהִ֔ים of God Noun
7363 [e] mə-ra-ḥe-p̄eṯ מְרַחֶ֖פֶת moved Verb
5921 [e] ‘al- עַל־ on Prep
6440 [e] pə-nê פְּנֵ֥י the face Noun
4325 [e] ham-mā-yim. הַמָּֽיִם׃ of the waters Noun

וַיֹּ֥אמֶר אֱלֹהִ֖ים יְהִ֣י אֹ֑ור וַֽיְהִי־אֹֽור׃

559 [e] way-yō-mer וַיֹּ֥אמֶר And said Verb
430 [e] ’ĕ-lō-hîm אֱלֹהִ֖ים God Noun
1961 [e] yə-hî יְהִ֣י Let there be Verb
216 [e] ’ō-wr; א֑וֹר light Noun
1961 [e] way-hî- וַֽיְהִי־ and there was Verb
216 [e] ’ō-wr. אֽוֹר׃ light Noun

וַיַּ֧רְא אֱלֹהִ֛ים אֶת־הָאֹ֖ור כִּי־טֹ֑וב וַיַּבְדֵּ֣ל אֱלֹהִ֔ים בֵּ֥ין הָאֹ֖ור וּבֵ֥ין הַחֹֽשֶׁךְ׃

7200 [e] way-yar וַיַּ֧רְא and saw Verb
430 [e] ’ĕ-lō-hîm אֱלֹהִ֛ים God Noun
853 [e] ’eṯ- אֶת־ Acc
216 [e] hā-’ō-wr הָא֖וֹר the light Noun
3588 [e] kî- כִּי־ that Conj
2896 [e] ṭō-wḇ; ט֑וֹב [it was] good Adj
914 [e] way-yaḇ-dêl וַיַּבְדֵּ֣ל and divided Verb
430 [e] ’ĕ-lō-hîm, אֱלֹהִ֔ים God Noun
996 [e] bên בֵּ֥ין a space between Prep
216 [e] hā-’ō-wr הָא֖וֹר the light Noun
996 [e] ū-ḇên וּבֵ֥ין and between Prep
2822 [e] ha-ḥō-šeḵ. הַחֹֽשֶׁךְ׃ the darkness Noun

וַיִּקְרָ֨א אֱלֹהִ֤ים ׀ לָאֹור֙ יֹ֔ום וְלַחֹ֖שֶׁךְ קָ֣רָא לָ֑יְלָה וַֽיְהִי־עֶ֥רֶב וַֽיְהִי־בֹ֖קֶר יֹ֥ום אֶחָֽד׃ פ

7121 [e] way-yiq-rā וַיִּקְרָ֨א And called Verb
430 [e] ’ĕ-lō-hîm אֱלֹהִ֤ים ׀ God Noun
216 [e] lā-’ō-wr לָאוֹר֙ the light Noun
3117 [e] yō-wm, י֔וֹם Day Noun
2822 [e] wə-la-ḥō-šeḵ וְלַחֹ֖שֶׁךְ and the darkness Noun
7121 [e] qā-rā קָ֣רָא he called Verb
3915 [e] lā-yə-lāh; לָ֑יְלָה Night Noun
1961 [e] way-hî- וַֽיְהִי־ And were Verb
6153 [e] ‘e-reḇ עֶ֥רֶב the evening Noun
1961 [e] way-hî- וַֽיְהִי־ and Verb
1242 [e] ḇō-qer בֹ֖קֶר the morning Noun
3117 [e] yō-wm י֥וֹם day Noun
259 [e] ’e-ḥāḏ. אֶחָֽד׃ the first Adj
פ

וַיֹּ֣אמֶר אֱלֹהִ֔ים יְהִ֥י רָקִ֖יעַ בְּתֹ֣וךְ הַמָּ֑יִם וִיהִ֣י מַבְדִּ֔יל בֵּ֥ין מַ֖יִם לָמָֽיִם׃

559 [e] way-yō-mer וַיֹּ֣אמֶר And said Verb
430 [e] ’ĕ-lō-hîm, אֱלֹהִ֔ים God Noun
1961 [e] yə-hî יְהִ֥י Let there be Verb
7549 [e] rā-qî-a‘ רָקִ֖יעַ a firmament Noun
8432 [e] bə-ṯō-wḵ בְּת֣וֹךְ in the midst Noun
4325 [e] ham-mā-yim; הַמָּ֑יִם of the waters Noun
1961 [e] wî-hî וִיהִ֣י let Verb
914 [e] maḇ-dîl, מַבְדִּ֔יל it divide Verb
996 [e] bên בֵּ֥ין a space between Prep
4325 [e] ma-yim מַ֖יִם the waters Noun
4325 [e] lā-mā-yim. לָמָֽיִם׃ from the waters Noun

וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִים֮ אֶת־הָרָקִיעַ֒ וַיַּבְדֵּ֗ל בֵּ֤ין הַמַּ֙יִם֙ אֲשֶׁר֙ מִתַּ֣חַת לָרָקִ֔יעַ וּבֵ֣ין הַמַּ֔יִם אֲשֶׁ֖ר מֵעַ֣ל לָרָקִ֑יעַ וַֽיְהִי־כֵֽן׃

6213 [e] way-ya-‘aś וַיַּ֣עַשׂ And made Verb
430 [e] ’ĕ-lō-hîm אֱלֹהִים֮ God Noun
853 [e] ’eṯ- אֶת־ Acc
7549 [e] hā-rā-qî-a‘ הָרָקִיעַ֒ the firmament Noun
914 [e] way-yaḇ-dêl, וַיַּבְדֵּ֗ל and divided Verb
996 [e] bên בֵּ֤ין a space between Prep
4325 [e] ham-ma-yim הַמַּ֙יִם֙ the waters Noun
834 [e] ’ă-šer אֲשֶׁר֙ which Prt
8478 [e] mit-ta-ḥaṯ מִתַּ֣חַת [were] under Noun
7549 [e] lā-rā-qî-a‘, לָרָקִ֔יעַ the firmament Noun
996 [e] ū-ḇên וּבֵ֣ין and from Prep
4325 [e] ham-ma-yim, הַמַּ֔יִם the waters Noun
834 [e] ’ă-šer אֲשֶׁ֖ר which Prt
5921 [e] mê-‘al מֵעַ֣ל [were] above Prep
7549 [e] lā-rā-qî-a‘; לָרָקִ֑יעַ the firmament Noun
1961 [e] way-hî- וַֽיְהִי־ and it was Verb
3651 [e] ḵên. כֵֽן׃ so Adj

וַיִּקְרָ֧א אֱלֹהִ֛ים לָֽרָקִ֖יעַ שָׁמָ֑יִם וַֽיְהִי־עֶ֥רֶב וַֽיְהִי־בֹ֖קֶר יֹ֥ום שֵׁנִֽי׃ פ

7121 [e] way-yiq-rā וַיִּקְרָ֧א And called Verb
430 [e] ’ĕ-lō-hîm אֱלֹהִ֛ים God Noun
7549 [e] lā-rā-qî-a‘ לָֽרָקִ֖יעַ the firmament Noun
8064 [e] šā-mā-yim; שָׁמָ֑יִם Heaven Noun
1961 [e] way-hî- וַֽיְהִי־ And were Verb
6153 [e] ‘e-reḇ עֶ֥רֶב the evening Noun
1961 [e] way-hî- וַֽיְהִי־ and Verb
1242 [e] ḇō-qer בֹ֖קֶר the morning Noun
3117 [e] yō-wm י֥וֹם day Noun
8145 [e] šê-nî. שֵׁנִֽי׃ the second Noun
פ

 

And now the KJV

1In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness [was] upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

The First Day: Light

3And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4And God saw the light, that [it was] good: and God divided the light from the darkness. 5And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

The Second Day: Firmament

6And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. 7And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which [were] under the firmament from the waters which [were] above the firmament: and it was so. 8And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.

So as you can see, he didn’t even care about staying true to what was originally delivered to us as the very Word of God.  He did violence to the word just like the enemy of God that he was.  If he was a true prophet of God his work would have been the same as the other works, but it isn’t.  These works, except the KJV predate the time when Joseph Smith says the apostasy happened.  Remember, the Mormons claim that after the death of the last Apostle the Church fell into complete apostasy, never mind all of the Christians who maintained their faith all over the world in the face of persecution and martyrdom.  He either didn’t know that these texts were out there or predated his claims that the Church was apostate or he didn’t care.  I think, he didn’t know.

So in verse 2 he lies and says that God said, “I am the Beginning and the End; the Almighty God. By mine Only Begotten I created these things.”  You might ask yourself, “What is so wrong with that?” Well you’d have to understand Mormonism a little bit to get why he did this.  You see Mormons believe that God the Father actually has a flesh and blood body and he is married to a Mother Goddess, who through copulation with him produced many offspring.  Two of them would be the Mormon Jesus and his brother Satan.  When he says, “by my only begotten I created these things.”  He means that Jesus reformed matter that was already in existence.  He shaped into what he wanted to make.  If you notice J.S. rewrote Genesis to make it look like God was saying all these things directly to Moses.  This is to support their book of Moses which is completely fiction.

It really starts to get weird in chapter three.  There we see Satan and Jesus arguing over who gets to redeem mankind and protect his free agency?  I’m not making this garbage up.  You can read it for yourselves;

Genesis CHAPTER 3 JST

Rebellion of Satan — Man’s agency, temptation and fall.

1 And I, the Lord God, spake unto Moses, saying, That Satan whom thou hast commanded in the name of mine Only Begotten, is the same which was from the beginning;

2 And he came before me, saying, Behold I, send me, I will be thy Son, and I will redeem all mankind, that one soul shall not be lost, and surely I will do it; wherefore, give me thine honor.

3 But behold, my beloved Son, which was my beloved and chosen from the beginning, said unto me: Father, thy will be done, and the glory be thine forever.

4 Wherefore, because that Satan rebelled against me, and sought to destroy the agency of man, which I, the Lord God, had given him; and also that I should give unto him mine own power; by the power of mine Only Begotten I caused that he should be cast down; and he became Satan.

5 Yea, even the devil, the father of all lies, to deceive, and to blind men, and to lead them captive at his will, even as many as would not hearken unto my voice.

6 And now, the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field, which I, the Lord God, had made.

7 And Satan put it into the heart of the serpent, for he had drawn away many after him; and he sought also to beguile Eve, for he knew not the mind of God; wherefore, he sought to destroy the world.

I know, right!?  What the what!?  Here is the real word of God;

1Now the serpent was more crafty than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said to the woman, “Indeed, has God said, ‘You shall not eat from any tree of the garden’?” 2The woman said to the serpent, “From the fruit of the trees of the garden we may eat; 3but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, ‘You shall not eat from it or touch it, or you will die.'” 4The serpent said to the woman, “You surely will not die! 5“For God knows that in the day you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” 6When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was desirable to make [one] wise, she took from its fruit and ate; and she gave also to her husband with her, and he ate. 7Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves loin coverings.

There are so many changes it is hard to know where to start.  If I had more ambition I’d attack his abuse of the book of Isaiah.  Comparing it to the entire book of Isaiah recovered from the Dead Sea Scrolls would be fun, but lots of work.  For now, I will leave you with this to ponder, why would a true prophet of God make so many false prophecies and contradict the Bible so often he would have to write his own to support it?  Why would you want to believe that God was once a man who through Mormonism became an exalted man then eventually a god who only re-ordered matter to make things?  Why would you not worship the one true God who has never been made because he always existed?  He was never a sinful man like the Mormon god once was.  The true God made everything from nothing.  He transcends all other things.  The Mormon god is subject to the gods that sired him and they are subject to the ones who sired them and so on and on back eternally.  Does that sound like the one true God, worthy of worship to you?

God is eternal and unchanging.

Biblical ignorance is one of the biggest obstacles for the evangelist to overcome. There are many false doctrines and misconceptions being propagated in society today. We have to answer so many false claims while practicing apologetics. Hopefully we can fix one of those problems today with this article.

God is eternal and unchanging. God has always been, and He has always been just as He is. He has never not been, or been in any different state.   He does not change. The nature of being uncaused and eternal is what we call, “the aseity of God.” The nature of not changing is what we call, “the immutability of God.” Both of these qualities are important when understanding God’s eternality and many of His other attributes. For today we are going to focus on His eternality, aseity, and immutability.

How do we answer, “If God is unchanging, didn’t He change when He turned into Jesus?” This demonstrates a woeful ignorance of theology. Children in the Puritan era might have asked this, but certainly not adults. It is true that if God’s nature changed during the incarnation we would have a problem. An eternal Creator that was not immutable could not be counted on to always be just, or good. So the fact that God is immutable is a blessing for us. God did not turn into Jesus at the incarnation. God was always as He is, Triune. He is one being in three persons. At the advent of Christ, the second person of the Holy Trinity, the eternal Son, joined Himself to human nature without mixing, or mingling His deity with His humanity. This is what we call the hypostatic union. It means that the incarnate God is 100% God and 100% man, joined together perfectly in accord with the will of God. The incarnation did not change God. This misinformed idea reveals how little we are trained in theology and Biblical truths.

The Mormons say that God was once a man, who was created by a father and mother god through natural means, who themselves were once mere humans, who were created by a father and mother, and on and on perpetually. This is how they understand their god to be eternal. How does our God differ? Our God is explained by His word. We know that He created everything. We know He didn’t just move matter around to form some things on this planet. If He created everything, and is the source of all things, then He would have no pre-existence as a man. He would not have been created by other gods, who were once human. He would be eternal all in and of Himself. I would ask the Mormons, “Who was the first god who made the first man, who later would become a god? Why wouldn’t you worship this first god who supposedly made the first man? Why would you worship a being who is not the creator of everything?” The God of the Bible is truly a transcendent being. He is above, and beyond any imaginings a person would have in conceiving a false god. That is why when you encounter a false religion it is easy to spot problems. Of course this is only true if you are a person who has been saved, and knows the true God. Once you know Him you can spot a fake. How could anyone worship such limited beings as the ones they imagine? It should blow us away when we hear some of these descriptions.

The God of the Bible created everything there is without diminishing Himself. He created it out of nothing. There was nothing there for Him to build things out of versus the god of Mormonism who just reformed matter and was the great great great great great great great great grandson of some other little god.   The winner is, the God of the Bible. This is one of the many reason that Mormons are not Christians. They might claim to be, but if they believe the doctrines of their cult, then they are not Christian. We obviously worship a different God than they do. Their god is a finite creature, created by others.

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Ours is NOT! We need to be happy about this, and correct them when they publicly claim to worship the same God. They cause confusion, and draw support when we don’t explain the differences.   A god who was created is not a god at all. Only a God who is transcends creation, who made everything without diminishing himself, who made everything from nothing makes sense.

What does it mean to be, “eternal?” Have you ever thought about this? Most of us have thought about what it would be like to live forever, but all we can really conceive of is living a very long time. We can’t imagine what it would be like to have no beginning or end. It is something that only God can understand fully.  Another idea about eternality, is that it is unseen.  We are in a temporal creation.  What we can see is limited by our nature.  God is being eternal.  We might ask, “Is it possible for any other being to be eternal outside of God?” The Bible says we will live forever with God if we are saved, but that isn’t being eternal. That is just being resurrected to everlasting life. We had a beginning. God created us, and He keeps us alive.  We were caused to exist, and He is the one who upholds our existence.  Even after we have left our temporal existence behind, and step into eternity, it will be because we have been made to do so by God.

It doesn’t it make sense to have another eternal being outside of God. If there was then God would not be alone and unique in His deity. There would be other Gods with separate wills, and equal power. We know that God says in His word that He is the only one, and that He is not a liar.

What about the gods of other faiths, are they eternal? This is simple, No.  They have never been.  They can’t be. For something to be eternal it would have to have always been, is being, and always will be.

If they are false, because they are not eternal, or actual, then what is going to happen to their worshipers, and why? If they never repent, and put their faith in Christ, then they are under the condemnation of their sin. They will die, and be found guilty of their sins. They will be in Hell suffering the torment of God’s wrath being poured out on them, not because they believed different, or because they didn’t grow up here, but because they are guilty sinners just like us.

How can they be saved? We must preach the gospel of Christ to them. They must repent of their sins, and trust in the work of Christ on the cross solely.  When they find out that they are sinners, their hearts must be convicted of this. They must be humbled, and become penitent. Then they must confess their sinfulness to God, and ask Him to forgive them. They must submit to God as their new master. They need to accept that they cannot earn favor with God. They need to rely, and fully trust in the finished, perfect,  atoning, work of Christ on the cross.